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Author	Topic: "Spiritual/out body experiences"
Satire Member	posted 01-09-2001 03:35 PM Hi Roman: I don't agree with these people. But some say: "If it feels good, it must be good!" Satire. quote: Originally posted by roman74: All this effort to keep believing just because it makes you feel good? Look at all the energy expended on wishful thinking .... Aren't there any Homeless Shelters in your individual towns where you guys can be more productive? [This message has been edited by Satire (edited 01-09-2001).] IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-09-2001 03:52 PM quote: Originally posted by francescoassisi: It has been one of the saddest. . . .no, most tragic, lessons of my life that sociopaths take on the most inviting and gregarious manners, bending over backward to please, at the outset of a relationship that suits their aims. Then whether they get their way or are denied it, some monstrous hate in them lurches outward to engulf all around. I have fallen naively prey to more than one in my life. I now can tell the truly sweet from the ambitiously so in a few encounters. Just watch for when they first reach for control. Control is the one motive they never lose sight of, and everyone be damned who gets in their way. [This message has been edited by francescoassisi (edited 01-07-2001).] Frances - I have a SISTER like that. I denied it for years, but now.. I realize that sometimes blood means nothing. IP: Logged
roman74 Member	posted 01-09-2001 04:00 PM quote: Miracles = Perceived cause/effect relationships of non-local events, due to the rationalization of emotional needs for meaning in purpose in an otherwise meaningless universe. This is opposed to directly observable cause/effect relationships that can be explained through empirical and consistent data. IP: Logged
roblguth Member	posted 01-09-2001 04:37 PM I don't know why I'm joining the fray, but no matter what I believe in, this following event occurred to me. I was a cop for 25 years in New Jersey (an eerie thing in itself). One night I awoke with a yell from a dream, startling my wife. She asked if I had a nightmare and I told her not really. I dreamt that I was speaking on the phone to Dr. Landy's nurse; nothing scary at all, yet I had a hard time getting back to sleep as I couldn't stop thinking about the dream. I had never met Dr. Landy and only knew his name because I was a cop. I eventually fell asleep and in the morning when I awoke, I had completely forgotten the dream. I went to work that morning and within ten minutes of arriving I received a phone call from a woman who said she awoke to find her husband dead on the floor in the kitchen. I dispatched a patrol car and the officer called me from the home confirming the man was dead and to call the family doctor for a pronouncement. The family doctor was Dr. Landy and as I looked up his number I never thought of the dream. When Dr. Landy's nurse answered the phone, the hair on the back of my neck stood up (that really happens I found out). I never did meet Dr. Landy or his nurse, nor ever dealt with them again in my career. What was my dream? Coincidence? I'm not so sure. IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-09-2001 04:54 PM quote: Originally posted by roblguth: I don't know why I'm joining the fray, but no matter what I believe in, this following event occurred to me. I was a cop for 25 years in New Jersey (an eerie thing in itself). One night I awoke with a yell from a dream, startling my wife. She asked if I had a nightmare and I told her not really. I dreamt that I was speaking on the phone to Dr. Landy's nurse; nothing scary at all, yet I had a hard time getting back to sleep as I couldn't stop thinking about the dream. I had never met Dr. Landy and only knew his name because I was a cop. I eventually fell asleep and in the morning when I awoke, I had completely forgotten the dream. I went to work that morning and within ten minutes of arriving I received a phone call from a woman who said she awoke to find her husband dead on the floor in the kitchen. I dispatched a patrol car and the officer called me from the home confirming the man was dead and to call the family doctor for a pronouncement. The family doctor was Dr. Landy and as I looked up his number I never thought of the dream. When Dr. Landy's nurse answered the phone, the hair on the back of my neck stood up (that really happens I found out). I never did meet Dr. Landy or his nurse, nor ever dealt with them again in my career. What was my dream? Coincidence? I'm not so sure. roblguth - Hi! I read some of your postings on other threads - you seem intelligent and nice! It sounds like you were beings warned of something that was probably meant to happen, as a way to lessen the shock to your system. This happens to people all the time. Some people call it coincidence, but some would call it a precognitive dream, which is what I believe you had. In other words, you were warned while you were in the astral (which occurs every night when we sleep, and to some people who can do it consciously). (This means you left your body while sleeping.) It seems when we have precognitive dreams, we go to a place (some call it the Hall of Probabilities) where we are allowed to look at what seems like a large screen which shows us visions of what will probably happen. To some people (especially those involved in the incident), they don't actually see a screen, they are IN the incident as it happens and when they wake and the incident occurs, it is sometimes referred to as deja vu. Ever follow up on a hunch while trying to solve a crime, etc.? IP: Logged
Enigmagirl Member	posted 01-10-2001 12:44 AM Psichick, I will be e-mailing you soon. Roman, this wasted energy you speak of. . .I don't think you understand: I get high off helping others out. I HAVE served meals to the homeless, I offer free tarot readings to those I feel need them (usually several a month), and I spend part of each day meditating for someone who has asked me to do so. Hell, I can be on cloud-nine all day just by helping out a broken-down car or offering to buy lunch for a stranger who can't afford it. If more people understood how GOOD it feels to "waste" their energy on beliefs that drove them to such deeds, we'd have a pretty ideal world. I believe that "God" is everything. . .and with that I try to see the piece of "God" in the homeless man begging for change, the "a$$hole" who just cut me off on the road, the hateful young man who wants so badly for me to hate him back. . . I used to be like you, Roman, so I can't judge your negative outlook on the subjects spoken about in this thread. . .I still, however, reserve the right to feel sorry for you. Best wishes. [This message has been edited by Enigmagirl (edited 01-10-2001).] IP: Logged
TommyTerror Member	posted 01-10-2001 01:07 AM I was like you too Roman, so I can understand the frustration you feel with what you consider false beliefs. But I don't approve of the way you chastise people, and the way you draw generic conclusions based on people's beliefs. Such as the idea that a person is irresponsible if they don't agree with you. Here's an experience I related on the ghost thread. The cool above post jogged my memory. Let's hear you respond to this, Roman, and how science would explain it. I was 22. I had not seen or talked to my Grandad in 3 years, altho I was very fond of him. At 11:00 one night, I was lying on my bed, and I saw a hallucination of my grandad flying through the window. He hovered over my bed, and seemed to telepathically convey a message to me. In my mind, I heard him tell me that he had died, and he wished me luck and love and said goodbye. It kind of looked like that fantasy that Mr. Smithers has about Mr. Burns flying over his bed, only not sexual, and whenever I see that Simpsons episode it always makes me think of my experience. So far, a hallucination, right? Totally imagined in my mind. The next morning I get a call from my mom. Sure enough, at 11 the night before my grandfather had an accident and died. Actually he had gotten up after my grandmother had fallen asleep to drink the pork juice which was forbidden on his diet, and he was drunk and he slipped and hit his head on the counter. Pork juice everywhere. So, I had a vision of my grandfather dying the exact time that he died in another state. I've never had another vision that distinct. I'm not saying the vision was really his ghost. I'm not saying this is proof of God, or the afterlife or anything. But please, explain this vision and the fact that it was true. IP: Logged
Enigmagirl Member	posted 01-10-2001 01:47 AM Tommy, given the quantum theory, "all is now; all is here" it would be quite easy for the essence of your grandfather to "appear" in front of you and inform you of his death. He wouldn't have to travel to get to you; the astrial doesn't work with such physical limitations. I say your "hallucination" was a true message. . .I'm sure quite a few people here will disagree. I've seen even less-believable things, so I don't need much convincing. IP: Logged
roblguth Member	posted 01-10-2001 09:20 AM Psichick, thanks for your insight (and compliment). My question is, Who or what was warning me about the event to take place? And why would I need a lessening of shock? As a cop who saw many shocking things, that phone call was hardly shocking to me. I tend to think that the man died during the night and his last thought was to call Dr. Landy (the phone in the kitchen was only a couple of feet away). Somehow his last thoughts were passed on to me. What do you think? IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-10-2001 04:22 PM quote: Originally posted by TommyTerror: I was like you too Roman, so I can understand the frustration you feel with what you consider false beliefs. But I don't approve of the way you chastise people, and the way you draw generic conclusions based on people's beliefs. Such as the idea that a person is irresponsible if they don't agree with you. Here's an experience I related on the ghost thread. The cool above post jogged my memory. Let's hear you respond to this, Roman, and how science would explain it. I was 22. I had not seen or talked to my Grandad in 3 years, altho I was very fond of him. At 11:00 one night, I was lying on my bed, and I saw a hallucination of my grandad flying through the window. He hovered over my bed, and seemed to telepathically convey a message to me. In my mind, I heard him tell me that he had died, and he wished me luck and love and said goodbye. It kind of looked like that fantasy that Mr. Smithers has about Mr. Burns flying over his bed, only not sexual, and whenever I see that Simpsons episode it always makes me think of my experience. So far, a hallucination, right? Totally imagined in my mind. The next morning I get a call from my mom. Sure enough, at 11 the night before my grandfather had an accident and died. Actually he had gotten up after my grandmother had fallen asleep to drink the pork juice which was forbidden on his diet, and he was drunk and he slipped and hit his head on the counter. Pork juice everywhere. So, I had a vision of my grandfather dying the exact time that he died in another state. I've never had another vision that distinct. I'm not saying the vision was really his ghost. I'm not saying this is proof of God, or the afterlife or anything. But please, explain this vision and the fact that it was true. Tommy - I agree with Enigmagirl - your granddada came to visit you in the astral as his 3rd dimensional body lay dead, because he wanted you to know that he was outta here! That's nice. My mother came to visit me after she died, but I didn't see her, I felt her presence only. IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-10-2001 04:28 PM quote: Originally posted by roblguth: Psichick, thanks for your insight (and compliment). My question is, Who or what was warning me about the event to take place? And why would I need a lessening of shock? As a cop who saw many shocking things, that phone call was hardly shocking to me. I tend to think that the man died during the night and his last thought was to call Dr. Landy (the phone in the kitchen was only a couple of feet away). Somehow his last thoughts were passed on to me. What do you think? Well, God usually warns us, but you may be right in this case. Since you did see many shocking things, what you guessed is probably right. Thanks for the correction! Have you ever had a hunch that helped you solve a crime? IP: Logged
TommyTerror Member	posted 01-10-2001 05:55 PM quote: Originally posted by psichick: Tommy - I agree with Enigmagirl - your granddada came to visit you in the astral as his 3rd dimensional body lay dead, because he wanted you to know that he was outta here! That's nice. My mother came to visit me after she died, but I didn't see her, I felt her presence only. When my other grandad died, and a couple friends, I knew it beforehand but I didn't see them. Like I said, I try to keep an open unbiased mind about these things, but from what I've read about astral travel this theory is the one that fits the best so far, I agree. as for Roblgut, I'd say you had a prophetic dream. Often dreams contain elements of what will happen to you the next day, kind of like a daily horoscope in your sleep. Like enigma and psi state, in dreams we go to that other place that is "all here, all now" - I bellleeeeeve. IP: Logged
roblguth Member	posted 01-11-2001 08:44 AM Well, yes, Tommy T., it was definitely prophetic. I've actually had a few things happen to me like that. And Psichic, I can't really think of any hunches I had off-hand, but then again, I never really thought of hunches as any real psychic ability. Cops just think in real strange ways. I'd like to talk more about this, but for now I've got to go... IP: Logged
Satire Member	posted 01-11-2001 01:58 PM This entire page is enlightment. Thank you all for sharing the astral experiences. Still can't do it myself. Yet! Thank you, Satire. IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-11-2001 02:07 PM quote: Originally posted by TommyTerror: When my other grandad died, and a couple friends, I knew it beforehand but I didn't see them. Like I said, I try to keep an open unbiased mind about these things, but from what I've read about astral travel this theory is the one that fits the best so far, I agree. as for Roblgut, I'd say you had a prophetic dream. Often dreams contain elements of what will happen to you the next day, kind of like a daily horoscope in your sleep. Like enigma and psi state, in dreams we go to that other place that is "all here, all now" - I bellleeeeeve. Hi, Tommy! When my father died (when I was 15), I had a precognitive dream that 2 strange men with knives attacked my father and killed him in the driveway. The next thing I knew, my father was scheduled for heart surgery and died on the operating table. We used to visit him the hospital every day before his operation, and the day of his operation, when we got in the elevator to go to the waiting room, he peeked through the little window down at us, and I remembered my dream and KNEW he was going to die, before they came in to tell us. I went into shock because my father was THE most important person in my life. But, I accepted that it was his time to go and that God warned me beforehand so that it wouldn't be so much of a shock. Subconsciously, I had time to adjust. If I hadn't, I don't know what would have happened. I started studying metaphysics shortly after that. IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-11-2001 02:10 PM quote: Originally posted by Satire: This entire page is enlightment. Thank you all for sharing the astral experiences. Still can't do it myself. Yet! Thank you, Satire. I can't consciously astral travel yet either! Boo hoo, whine, whine!! IP: Logged
Enigmagirl Member	posted 01-11-2001 11:01 PM I've actually gotten there a few times; on average it took between ten and twenty minutes of deep meditation to even get anywhere. In "finding" people it's hit and miss; you don't really "travel" anywhere. . .it's moreso like being in more than one place at the same time. One thing I've found is that, when astrially looking at someone, infections look like red dots in the body and irritation and inflamation look like black dots. I've already learned how to perform minor "pranic" healings by flushing out the red and black "dots" with white light. Sounds out there, I know. . . IP: Logged
richbo Member	posted 01-11-2001 11:35 PM y'know i used to like this post until roman74 came sniffing around... IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-11-2001 11:48 PM quote: Originally posted by Enigmagirl: I've actually gotten there a few times; on average it took between ten and twenty minutes of deep meditation to even get anywhere. In "finding" people it's hit and miss; you don't really "travel" anywhere. . .it's moreso like being in more than one place at the same time. One thing I've found is that, when astrially looking at someone, infections look like red dots in the body and irritation and inflamation look like black dots. I've already learned how to perform minor "pranic" healings by flushing out the red and black "dots" with white light. Sounds out there, I know. . . Wow, I'm impressed! I did create a double of myself and went to what I believe was Germany once and had several snips of astral travelling, but have never been able to consciously leave my body, travel around, return to my body and remember the entire incident. BOO HOO!! Whine, whine! IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-11-2001 11:50 PM quote: Originally posted by richbo: y'know i used to like this post until roman74 came sniffing around... Hi, Richbo, how're you doing?! I missed you. Well, maybe if we completely ignore him he'll eventually get bored and will leave us alone? Janet IP: Logged
richbo Member	posted 01-12-2001 12:00 AM i don't know- is he gone? is RicoLaser still here? Do i even know where HERE is?????????????????????????????????????????????? IP: Logged
TommyTerror Member	posted 01-12-2001 12:13 AM Hey EnigmaGirl... can you look for buried treasure when you're out of body? I really wanna know.... Once a long time ago I was standing a few people behind this old guy in line at the supermarket, and he was so old and weathered, I filled him with white light, as I often did back then. He immediately reared up and spun around and yelled "Cut that out" at me. It's not like I start waving my arms or anything. You'd never be able to tell I was filling someone with white light. So quickly I mentally cleared the karma between us to be done with it, and again he turns around and yells "I told you to cut that out!". Everyone was staring at me, they thought he was crazy. It was funny. And I've stopped filling people with white light unless they ask for it, or I can't help myself. IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-12-2001 12:16 AM quote: Originally posted by richbo: i don't know- is he gone? is RicoLaser still here? Do i even know where HERE is?????????????????????????????????????????????? I don't know where he is. Haven't seen him lately! ha. Aren't we on a computer server somewhere in California? ha, ha. Take care! See ya around! IP: Logged
richbo Member	posted 01-12-2001 12:33 AM Thanks for the responce psichick! to the guy with the white light power- Hey man, don't quit-! people usually respond negatively with imbibed power- (i have a few gifts myself that i normally don't use except in extraordinary circumstances-) i could tell you a few stories... IP: Logged
Enigmagirl Member	posted 01-12-2001 02:21 AM LOL, Tommy!!! IP: Logged
Isabel Member	posted 01-12-2001 04:34 AM HI richbo, still here? IP: Logged
roblguth Member	posted 01-12-2001 04:54 AM quote: Originally posted by richbo: Thanks for the responce psichick! to the guy with the white light power- Hey man, don't quit-! people usually respond negatively with imbibed power- (i have a few gifts myself that i normally don't use except in extraordinary circumstances-) i could tell you a few stories...I want to hear them. IP: Logged
Satire Member	posted 01-12-2001 03:47 PM Hi Psichick: I referred Billhays to this thread because on the GOD thread he thinks Out of Body Experience are nothing more than Dreams. If he is serious, maybe some of you can help him. He could just be contrary. I am not sure yet. Get him some help if he comes over here and demonstrates sincerity. Thank you. Satire. quote: Originally posted by psichick: Hi, Richbo, how're you doing?! I missed you. Well, maybe if we completely ignore him he'll eventually get bored and will leave us alone? Janet IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-12-2001 04:09 PM quote: Originally posted by Satire: Hi Psichick: I referred Billhays to this thread because on the GOD thread he thinks Out of Body Experience are nothing more than Dreams. If he is serious, maybe some of you can help him. He could just be contrary. I am not sure yet. Get him some help if he comes over here and demonstrates sincerity. Thank you. Satire. Hi Satire - okay, but I think enigmagirl has the power to consciously astral travel! ENVY! She might be good at helping him out. Janet IP: Logged
Satire Member	posted 01-12-2001 04:11 PM Hi Enigmagirl: I'm facinated, tell us more. Satire. quote: Originally posted by Enigmagirl: I've actually gotten there a few times; on average it took between ten and twenty minutes of deep meditation to even get anywhere. In "finding" people it's hit and miss; you don't really "travel" anywhere. . .it's moreso like being in more than one place at the same time. One thing I've found is that, when astrially looking at someone, infections look like red dots in the body and irritation and inflamation look like black dots. I've already learned how to perform minor "pranic" healings by flushing out the red and black "dots" with white light. Sounds out there, I know. . . IP: Logged
Enigmagirl Member	posted 01-13-2001 01:18 AM Start meditating. It's not the funnest thing in the world to decide to do at first, but after a while it actually becomes something to look forward to. Start with something small (ten minutes or so), then slowly increase the amount of time as you become more comfortable. Focus on your breathing, slowing it, and let thoughts go as they come. After a while, you'll start to pick up on things, perceptual changes. I believe things will come naturally after that. Anyone can do it, in my opinion -- but don't expect results overnight . . .maybe a couple of years. . . IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-13-2001 06:08 AM quote: Originally posted by Enigmagirl: Start meditating. It's not the funnest thing in the world to decide to do at first, but after a while it actually becomes something to look forward to. Start with something small (ten minutes or so), then slowly increase the amount of time as you become more comfortable. Focus on your breathing, slowing it, and let thoughts go as they come. After a while, you'll start to pick up on things, perceptual changes. I believe things will come naturally after that. Anyone can do it, in my opinion -- but don't expect results overnight . . .maybe a couple of years. . . Thanks for your help! Janet aka psichick IP: Logged
Satire Member	posted 01-13-2001 12:49 PM Hi Enigmagirl: I will try it. Hope it works. I know it works for others. Please send your e-mail address to: Satire@WriteMe.com So when they erase this board we can stay in touch. Satire. quote: Originally posted by Enigmagirl: Start meditating. It's not the funnest thing in the world to decide to do at first, but after a while it actually becomes something to look forward to. Start with something small (ten minutes or so), then slowly increase the amount of time as you become more comfortable. Focus on your breathing, slowing it, and let thoughts go as they come. After a while, you'll start to pick up on things, perceptual changes. I believe things will come naturally after that. Anyone can do it, in my opinion -- but don't expect results overnight . . .maybe a couple of years. . . IP: Logged
blobello Member	posted 01-13-2001 03:16 PM You people should look into the effects of Temporal Lobe Epilepsy, and how normal, everyday physical interruptions of the brain can produce all the same effects you think are so unique or other-wordly. You may as well all be dreaming, because the brain has been known to produce sensations that may seem very real to you at the time, until you find out that those same feelings are the same those who have brain malfunctions experience. Seriously read what those people go through and you won't be so proud or stubborn at your so-called revelations. Brain tumors are not that all uncommon anymore. The few of you here who admit to these sensations might instead go get some x-rays and be tested for more serious problems than hyper-imaginations. IP: Logged
TommyTerror Member	posted 01-13-2001 04:48 PM There is a lot of testimony of people who have travelled out of body to observe friends and family across the continent and later were able to confirm the way they were dressed, the activities they saw them doing at a given time, etc. IP: Logged
Enigmagirl Member	posted 01-14-2001 01:45 AM quote: Originally posted by blobello: You people should look into the effects of Temporal Lobe Epilepsy, and how normal, everyday physical interruptions of the brain can produce all the same effects you think are so unique or other-wordly. You may as well all be dreaming, because the brain has been known to produce sensations that may seem very real to you at the time, until you find out that those same feelings are the same those who have brain malfunctions experience. Seriously read what those people go through and you won't be so proud or stubborn at your so-called revelations. Brain tumors are not that all uncommon anymore. The few of you here who admit to these sensations might instead go get some x-rays and be tested for more serious problems than hyper-imaginations. Blobello, I understand your points. . .it is not evident in these threads how deeply a woman of science I am. I understand how, with the documented effects of practices such as sensory-deprivation and hallucination-creating disorders of the mind, stories written by myself and others here may seem hard to swallow -- especially if you've never witnessed anything with your own eyes (etc.) to prove our validity. Yes, seizure disorders do exist, brain tumors and diseases such as schizhphrenia can create delusions of similar epiphany. My family saw me as crazy throughout my childhood -- especially when I started seeing auras and talking of "strange theories" -- but now even my elders come to me for counsel. My "crazy theories" are now actually becoming proven scientific realities. Call it "spiritually intune," call it psychosis -- it's not my concern to tell you what to believe -- my life has seemingly been one supernatural event after another. . .and either I have been part of several group hallucinations, or my true autobiography will be significantly better than fiction. IP: Logged
Satire Member	posted 01-14-2001 08:54 AM Hi Enigmagirl: You have stated your case with perfection. Also Blobello = Roman, so you have answered then both. Satire. quote: Originally posted by Enigmagirl: Blobello, I understand your points. . .it is not evident in these threads how deeply a woman of science I am. I understand how, with the documented effects of practices such as sensory-deprivation and hallucination-creating disorders of the mind, stories written by myself and others here may seem hard to swallow -- especially if you've never witnessed anything with your own eyes (etc.) to prove our validity. Yes, seizure disorders do exist, brain tumors and diseases such as schizhphrenia can create delusions of similar epiphany. My family saw me as crazy throughout my childhood -- especially when I started seeing auras and talking of "strange theories" -- but now even my elders come to me for counsel. My "crazy theories" are now actually becoming proven scientific realities. Call it "spiritually intune," call it psychosis -- it's not my concern to tell you what to believe -- my life has seemingly been one supernatural event after another. . .and either I have been part of several group hallucinations, or my true autobiography will be significantly better than fiction. IP: Logged
psichick Member	posted 01-14-2001 06:27 PM quote: Originally posted by TommyTerror: There is a lot of testimony of people who have travelled out of body to observe friends and family across the continent and later were able to confirm the way they were dressed, the activities they saw them doing at a given time, etc. True, Tommy. There are a few doctors who even did private studies on how many of their patients had OBEs, with startling results. In one study, this doctor (name escapes me) only used the testimony of children to make the study purer and uncontaminated in his view. Interesting, huh? IP: Logged
francescoassisi Member	posted 01-14-2001 08:27 PM quote: Originally posted by blobello: You people should look into the effects of Temporal Lobe Epilepsy, and how normal, everyday physical interruptions of the brain can produce all the same effects you think are so unique or other-wordly. You may as well all be dreaming, because the brain has been known to produce sensations that may seem very real to you at the time, until you find out that those same feelings are the same those who have brain malfunctions experience. Seriously read what those people go through and you won't be so proud or stubborn at your so-called revelations. Brain tumors are not that all uncommon anymore. The few of you here who admit to these sensations might instead go get some x-rays and be tested for more serious problems than hyper-imaginations. Did you ever stop to think that the physical basis for these experiences is exactly what enables people to transcend them. It's like the springboard for jumping higher. The ladder for climbing. The support for a leaping dance. What makes an experience possible should never be confused with the experience itself. That's like saying the clothes I'm wearing are what I feel while wearing them. Perhaps it's the body that allows us entry into a world in which it can't follow. There's the body that allows us to sense an experience and there's the realm that is sensed. BUT THAT"S NOT WHY I'M HERE. I just want to invite all my friends here to read my DO YOU PREFER THE STALKER OR THE SAINT THREAD and post your comments there. Thanks, all. IP: Logged
Satire Member	posted 01-15-2001 08:39 AM The following was posted on the "Is there a God Thread" in answer to questions of BillHays concernong Out of Body Experiences so it really belongs on this thread. Satire Member posted 01-14-2001 05:44 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- BillHays: Science is antiquated in this field, just like they are in getting the homeless off the streats of Amreica. There is no money in it! We put a man on the moon, while many starve in our streets. Science follows the dollar. If there was money in finding the answer to OBE, we would be well on our way to a coordinated research project. No bucks, no Lucks! Nearly everything you say below has already been stated on the OBE thread. Why do you waste our time when all you have to do is read that thread? You told me you researched this subject 20 years ago. That was the time of Jeane Dixon's book "Gift of Phrophecy" 1965 and her many annual predictions,long out dated. Get with the program. You are hung up on EYES and Sight. Here is what many involved in Psychic Phenomena Believe today in 2001. Copyright 2001 Roach Family Trust. Excerpts from Abstract of Screenplay 1. Many of us have had many previous lives. 2. We are given a choice to return to life as we know it to improve ourselves over some past experience. We know God exists where we come from. 3. We pick our parents and know how we will die before we agree to return to another life. 4. Birth is a horrible experience far worse that death. 5. Our Mind is almost blank, remembering not from whence we came nor our objective in life. We do not remember God and must learn of God's existance all over again. 6. The body grows and the mind learns. 7. Assuming you live to your 90s The body reaches maturity in the 30s, and begins to show signs of aging in the 40s until various others signs of aging appear in the 50s and 60s. In many cases the body ages even more in the 70s, 80s, and 90s until it is so shriveled up in aging that it is not recognizable as the person at a mature 35. You certainly would not want a 90 year old body in the other dimension. 8. The mind however continues to grow without aging at all except for certain diseases. 9. You are the essence of your mind at its peak so you do not die. When your mind leaves your body it moves back to where it came from to evaluate whether you have benefited from the past life. 10. Friends, relatives or the State dispose of your aged shell of a body. 11. Your mind enters the light at the end of what OBE people have claimed is a tunnel. You are met by those of previous lives that you know and welcome you to this dimension. 12. They recognize either your spirit or you now having a body. Which body? If you have been reincarnated multiple times. Most likely the body you had before you left for another life. Some believe there is no body necessary as your spirit or mind or soul is all that is necessary. 13. Is there sex in this dimension? Not as we know it. It is actually better. Your essence can actually enter the essence of the loved one completely and entirely and experience the loved one's essence to the fullest. 14. You are met by your choice of who you believed in: be it, Jesus, Mohamad, Budda etc. to discuss the pros and cons of your past life. God the Creator is also present. 15. You have an opportunity to stay and be happy or return to life and experience still another level of improvement. 16. I sure hope I am ready to stay this time. We have all been pretty patient with you Billhays and don't want to write your OEB or psychic Phenomena screenplay for you. Some of us are doing our own. Your questions deal with physical things, not psychic experiences. Simply said, you either die when your body is of no longer use to you, or you do not die and move on to the next dimension. After careful study I choose the latter. Satire. IP: Logged

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